Friday, September 21, 2018

The Weenie Tax

"Every hot dog, beer purchased in that district will go
toward the stadium."

Tampa, Fl
From: Eye On Tampa Bay
Posted by: Sharon Calvert

Plans to fund the planned new Tampa Bay Rays stadium near Ybor City are emerging.

"Every hot dog, beer purchased in that district will go toward the stadium."

Taxing hot dogs and beer to pay for a stadium? Now you got my attention.

From the TBBJ:
A group of business leaders working on efforts to move the Tampa Bay Rays to Ybor City is evaluating different funding strategies for the proposed $892 million, glass-domed ballpark.
Ambassadors of Rays 2020, led by Tampa attorney Ron Christaldi and Chuck Sykes, CEO of Sykes Enterprises, spoke during a Rotary Club of Ybor City meeting on Sept. 12 and addressed the questions the Rays face, which primarily are concerns with how the stadium would be funded
"[We will be] working with the landowners to create a CDD type of environment for an entertainment district. Every hot dog, beer purchased in that district will go toward the stadium so it's not taxpayer money, it's a fee-based structure," said Hillsborough County Commissioner Ken Hagan, the county's chief negotiator with the Rays.

The entertainment district tax will be used to land more funding.
"We have to be extremely creative for the necessary funding. The goal on that is to cast as much of a wide of a net as possible," Hagan said.

We can be creative too, especially when it affects my hot dogs and beer.  I must have a hot dog at every sporting event I attend. I am not making this up.

                                                      Don't tax my weenie!
                                                    (Credit rones,

Just how many weenies will have to be sold to pay for the new Rays stadium?

The latest stadium cost estimates are $892 million, and the Rays, whose estimated value is $900 million, stated they will contribute $150 million to the overall costs. That leaves $742 million to be funded. By hot dogs?

The new stadium plans call for 28,216 seats, which is a reduction in the total capacity of Tropicana field, where attendance average is reported to be 14,700.

Using some simple math (and zero interest rate to keep it simple for now), assuming that every game sells out for 82 home games a year, and everyone is like me, needs a hot dog at every game, and $1 from each weenie "purchased in that district will go toward the stadium", it will take at least 320 years to pay off the stadium.

Or we could pay off the CDD bonds in 32 years... if we charged a $10 fee per hot dog.

Thats a lot of weenies that are bought with "not taxpayers money", which begs the question... exactly whose money is it buying weenies?

Isn't this a reductio ad absurdum argument?

Of course it is. As is the whole notion on funding the stadium with a CDD.

According to Wikipedia,
A community development district (CDD) is a local, special-purpose government framework authorized by Chapter 190[1] of the Florida Statutes as amended, and is an alternative to municipal incorporation for managing and financing infrastructure required to support development of a community.[1]
Florida has hundreds of CDDs, and they are meant to provide an alternative to funding the development of new communities from the traditional municipal governance. The developer takes a lead role in funding and developing the infrastructure, which in turn are paid back in fees from the residents of the development, which has been bonded out by the developer as municipal bonds. The developer is not paying for it. The new residents are.

CDDs can go bad, as they are typically dependent upon a 20 to 30 year payback schedule. Developments don't always go as planned, and Florida has at least 100 CDDs that are some form of financial distress.

Field of Schemes noted some inconsistencies with the CDD plans.
There are, however, a couple of problems here. One is that it’s not entirely clear whether a new stadium is the kind of amenity that actually makes nearby land more valuable — and if it doesn’t, you could end up seeing property values plunging as nobody wants to buy land that comes with a whopping surcharge, or even see the CDD go into default, as has happened from time to time. So if this does end up part of a Rays stadium funding plan, it’s going to be hugely important who’s on the hook for those payments if the CDD money falls short.

Then there’s that puzzling statement by Hagan that “every hot dog, beer purchased in that district will go toward the stadium.” He also said “we are not going to raise sales taxes,” so presumably there won’t be an actual surcharge on sales of stadium-district beer, just on property taxes for stadium-district beer gardens. Which is a pretty indirect and hand-wavy way of ensuring that the stadium will in some way pay for itself, probably because without the hand waving, it’d be immediately clear that there aren’t enough windfall hot dog profits to build a near-billion-dollar stadium.
So what happens when a CDD goes bankrupt?

New investors developers may take over. They may be able to buy the defaulted bonds at firesale prices, and develop new properties at much lower costs, reducing the value of other district properties, thus property tax revenues.

Of course, as with most of these schemes with CRA, TIF, and CDD, the ultimate backstop is the taxpayer. City of Tampa and Hillsborough County will be at risk of over a billion dollars to take over a failing CDD as central to the plans of the area as the new Rays Stadium.

Don't be surprised, as the fat cats behind the Rays Stadium are aligned with many other schemes to enrich themselves at the taxpayer expense. If there is one thing that is near unanimous across Tampa Bay, it is the fact that a vast majority of Tampa Bay residents do not what their hard earned taxes spent on sports stadiums.

Yet here we are again, politicians and business leaders ignoring the people the "serve".

Who's among those behind the Rays funding plan?

Chuck Sykes, whom we've documented as one of the lead cronies behind the special interest lead All For Transportation Transit 14% sales tax increase now on the November ballot in Hillsborough.

Then there is this, again from the TBBJ:
"We are talking to businesses that aren't here, tourism-related companies, talking to those kinds of companies, but also because of Brightline and that connection from Tampa to Orlando, we are starting to talk to more businesses along [Interstate] 4 even into Orlando," [Rays 2020 Ambassador Mike] Griffin said.

"The fact that walking distance from here we can [or will] literally walk to a train that's privately funded and be in Orlando in a half hour, that's really exciting," he added.
Griffin, on the thinking track of transit, also mentioned how important it is in general to have different modes of transit for the stadium.

The site already has parking within walking distance. More garages we will be built, but the existing infrastructure is in place, Griffin said. About 18 percent of people who go to ball games use Uber or Lyft, and it's projected that usage will increase to 30 percent by the time a ballpark is built, Griffin said, speaking on available parking spaces as well as ridesharing options.

"The other aspect to this is access to our waterfront. We are very close to our port. I believe we have a great opportunity to really open up our waterways, not just for recreational watercraft, but the expansion of our water taxi service to that vision of being able to get to this ballpark without ever stepping foot in a car is real," Griffin said. "They do it in Miami, I'm sure we can do it here."

Lots of big plans and big talk. This sounds similar to Tampa's nearby Vinikville, Water Street, which has similar big plans and big talk, but little to show, about new business and companies relocating and expanding around downtown Tampa. Now there is more development around downtown Tampa, diluting the market.

Brightline's plans do not include any rail that will "be in Orlando in a half hour". That's not "really exciting". That's a lie.

This passage just confirms the linkage with the All for Transportation Transit Charter Amendment on the November ballot in Hillsborough. There is no parking nearby the proposed Rays Stadium. They won't be selling out those 28,216 seats unless they fix that situation.  They are expecting this transit boondoggle to save the day.

Something tells me more than my weenies are at risk.

You might also ask, who is the weenie?

If you have to ask, you are the weenie.

Posted by EyeOn TampaBay at 8:25 AM

This post is contributed by EYE ON TAMPA BAY. The views expressed in this post are the blog publisher's and do not necessarily reflect those of the publisher of Bay Post Internet.

Cross Posted with permission from: Eye On Tampa Bay

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Tuesday, September 18, 2018

City Council reviewing City Noise Ordinance.

Can St. Petersburg be both VIBRANT and GREEN

St. Petersburg Fl
Public Opinion by author: 

Robert Neff

With the upcoming Noise Ordinance discussion at the September 20th Public Services and Infrastructure committee meeting, the City Council is poised to revise the noise ordinance. The City has failed to enforce the noise ordinance. Both Mayor Kriseman and City Council Member Kornell are pro-noise. 
It took decades to educate people on the dangers of second-hand smoke,” anti-noise protester Bradley Vite told the Washington Post recently. “We may need decades to show the impact of second-hand noise.

The City has been working on the noise ordinance revision for well over a year. Council started hearing the City presentations in January 2018. The City was well aware of the noise issue in the downtown area, but was not aware of the noise issue residents faced from bars outside of downtown's border. While Mayor Kriseman has been not been proactive or leading this City on the noise issue, the City Council has procrastinated. The inaction demonstrates a lack of concern for resident's quality of life.

If the City reduces the repeat calls to both establishments that serve alcohol and residences, then this will drastically increase resident's quality of life.

What do concerned residents want?

Concerned residents impacted by the noise have been held hostage by the bars and the St. Petersburg Chamber of Commerce. We support a stronger noise ordinance that measures the noise with decibel levels at a level that does not impact adult and children's health. We also want a noise ordinance that fines the bar or establishment that serves alcohol. The current noise ordinance fines an individual employee who works there.

Can St. Petersburg be both VIBRANT and GREEN?

Mayor Kriseman's pro-business position has overlooked the noise issue. Several Council members are struggling with the meaning of the decibel level, duration of the exposure, and how this impacts your health. 

Unfortunately, the City has not invited a noise health expert to present to the committee. Despite requests to City Council and the City to hear from a noise health expert, the City has excluded a noise health expert in multiple public and committee discussions on the noise ordinance revision. It is time for City Council, Mayor Kriseman, and Police Chief Holloway to understand how noise impacts adults and kids health. 

The Mayor and Council want a vibrant city and “Green” presence, but the "green" part has been put on the back burner. The City of St. Petersburg's City Council has the opportunity to revise the noise ordinance and protects resident's quality of life.  

Will the Democratic Majority on City Council Protect Resident's Quality of Life?

The Democrats have a 5-1 majority on City Council. However, there is one obstacle the Democratic majority faces, and that is City Council Member Steve Kornell, a democrat, who is Chair of Public Services and Infrastructure Committee. Kornell is pro-noise. His comments are available online at the end of the article.

The lone Republican Ed Montanari had invited former Mayor Foster to speak on behalf of Jannus Live and others. Former Mayor Foster spoke for higher decibel limits. This position does not improve resident's quality of life. Former Mayor Foster's presence had to be approved by PSI Vice Chair Kornell's, and was. Montanari appears poised to favor a noise ordinance recommendation that supports the bars, and not resident's quality of life. 

Residents must hope the four remaining democratic council members protect resident's quality of life! 

Remind City Council

It is important to remind Council that residents have suffered under the past and current noise ordinance. The City can make a statement with the noise ordinance revision and demonstrate a concern for resident's quality of life. City Council and Mayor Kriseman can either protect resident’s quality of life and health or cater to businesses and special interests led by the bars and the Chamber of Commerce. 

Residents are tired of listening to the thumping inside the home, feeling the walls vibrate, or dealing with a "Do Nothing" Police Department. Residents are tired of Chief Holloway's Police Department targeting callers as re-occurring complainants. 

The City Council is resident’s last line of defense residents have before seeking a legal remedy. 

When Former Mayor Foster represented Jannus Live and several businesses, and spoke at a PSI meeting, he demonstrated a lack of understanding of the noise and the noise issue. Jannus commissioned noise study has serious flaws in its recommendations that support its position. The Jannus Live owner also spoke at the 2nd Noise Ordinance Public Hearing where he shared with the packed auditorium that he does not live downtown, because it is too noisy. Downtown residents did not appreciate that statement.

At the 2nd Public Hearing, the City was asked how many citations had there been. The City did not know. This graphic illustrates the City Noise issue and the lack of enforcement.

World Health Organization Issued Noise Recommendation

The World Health Organization’s recently published an article that has "recommended to avoid long-term damage, we should only expose ourselves to noise 70 dbs or less. Anything above 85 dbs is considered the danger zone for hearing loss. Exposure to 105 dbs – the average dbs in a bar – for at least one hour is enough to cause long-term damage.”

How Can You Help?

You can help by contacting your City Council Member, and Mayor Kriseman asking them to protect resident's quality of life. You may also attend the Public Services & Infrastructure Committee Meeting on Thursday, September 20 at City Hall, Conference Room 10. If you are unable to attend, this is available live on StPete TV and later on St. Petersburg's YouTube Channel.

Listen to Kornell and others speak at Public Services and Infrastructure Committee Meeting

Kornell’s Jabil Intro to Music Industry at Apr 2018 PSI St. Petersburg

Kornell has couple requests at Apr 2018 PSI St. Petersburg

Kornell Introducing former Mayor Foster at Apr 2018 PSI St. Petersburg

Kornell proposed Montanari’s request for Foster to speak at Apr 2018 PSI St. Petersburg

Gerdes on bars policing themselves at Apr 12 2018 PSI St. Petersburg

Council Member Kornell’s impassioned speech for the Music Industry at April 2018 PSI meeting
Kornell on Music Industry Apr 12 2018—PSI 

Former Mayor Foster speaks at PSI Committee meeting on Apr 12 2018, St. Petersburg
Foster Speaks at Apr 12 2018—PSI
The opinions here are the author's and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bay Post Internet or the Blog Publishers where it appears.

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Sunday, September 16, 2018

The Transit Tax Turmoil in Hillsborough County

By Developers, for developers 

St. Petersburg, Fl 
Opinion by: E. Eugene Webb PhD 
Author: In Search of Robin, So You Want to Blog
There are bad tax proposals and then there are really bad tax proposals like the one being offered to Hillsborough County residents on the November Ballot. This Ballot initiative has enough holes in it to embarrass a block of Swiss cheese.
If you are considering voting YES on this Referendum, you will need to do some serious research. Below are a bunch of links to articles and Blog Posts about the referendum and the use of the funds it will generate.
Here is the link to the Hillsborough County General Election Sample Ballot
The Transit Tax initiative is on Page 5.
The end game is this. This All Florida Transportation initiative is even more poorly conceived, planned and promoted than Greenlight Pinellas and Go Hillsborough.
The revenue from this tax is controlled by an unknown board appointed by unnamed elected officials. The tax applies to all residents of Hillsborough County, but a significant portion of the funds goes to just three Cities. Another large chunk goes to HART the Hillsborough County Bus line. They're very inadequate controls and a significant lack of accountability.
It may be time for a tax to support transportation improvement in Hillsborough County, but this proposal is a light rail/developer’s delight not a commuter’s solution.
E-mail Doc at mail to: or send me a Facebook (E. Eugene Webb) Friend request. Like or share on Facebook and follow me on TWITTER  @DOC ON THE BAY.
See Doc's Photo Gallery at 
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Contributor to: Rick Scott for Senate 

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Friday, September 14, 2018

2010 All Over Again! Tampa Bay Partnership Funds Another Massive Rail Tax Hike

Tampa, Fl
From: Eye On Tampa Bay
Posted by: Sharon Calvert
Or not.
Voters and taxpayers are not funding the All for Transit (AFT) 30 year 14% rail tax hike.
The Tampa Bay Partnership, leader of the local rail cartel, is at it again.
According to AFT's latest campaign filing on the SOE website, $175K was recently donated to the AFT transit tax hike PAC - from two donors.
BayCare Health Systems donated $50K and Tampa General Hospital funneled $125K through their wholly owned coffee shop subsidiary. (really…)
BayCare & TGH donate to AFT
Seven special interests donors have donated $925K to push the unnecessary massive 30 year transit tax hike scheme scam of deception on local taxpayers. 
While almost a million dollars have been donated by special interests cronies, only $1025 has been donated by individuals - in a county of 1.3 million people. The dismal support by those who actually can vote may indicate how totally underwhelmed voters and taxpayers are about raising their sales taxes to the highest in the state. Especially for a $16 Billion transit tax hike that includes Billions for costly rail but Zero funding for new roads and new lane capacity - for 30 years.
AFT donors Jeff Vinik, Sykes Enterprises and of course the Tampa Bay Partnership itself are all connected to the Partnership. BayCare and Tampa General Hospital (TGH) are also $50K pay to play members of the Tampa Bay Partnership.
BayCare gave at least $25K to Greenlight Pinellas in 2014.
BayCare donates to Greenlight Pinellas PAC in 2014
When we looked at BayCare Health Systems 990 for 2014, which is available thru Guidestar, we could not find the $25K donation to the Greenlight Pinellas political advocacy campaign accounted for in their Schedule C - Political Campaign and Lobbying Activities. Wonder why.
House of Coffee Tampa is a Starbucks franchise that operates in Tampa General Hospital and TGH Brandon Healthplex. House of Coffee's legal entity is TGHHOC, Inc. which is a for profit wholly owned subsidiary of Florida Health Sciences Inc.
Florida Health Sciences, Inc. is the nonprofit legal entity Tampa General Hospital operates under. 
It seems a bit odd for a 2 site coffeehouse to be handing $125K to a PAC. But for profit corporations do not have the limits or restrictions on engaging in political activity that nonprofits have.
Therefore, it appears TGH funneled their $125K PAC contribution to AFT through their for profit coffee house subsidiary. A bit misleading huh?
The President and CEO of Tampa General Hospital John Couris, who receives a total salary package over a million dollars a year, was hired last June from Jupiter, FL. Coincidentally, Couris had previously worked at BayCare.
Couris is on the Board of Florida Health Sciences Inc. (TGH) and interestingly Kathleen Shanahan is also on the Board of Florida Health Sciences (TGH)).
The plot thickens. Shanahan is currently a city of Tampa (Mayor Buckhorn) appointee to the HART Board and she is HART's representative on TBARTA.
HART would get so much transit tax dollars from AFT's rail tax hike, they would literally be swimming in it. We bet TBARTA, created by the state at the request of Tampa Bay Partnership, will want a piece of the massive transit funding action too.
And schizophrenia abounds. For the last few years, Tampa Bay Partnership has been running around Tampa Bay, Tallahassee and DC pushing regionalism and lecturing us all that we must regionally speak as one kum ba ya voice - to get more state and federal tax dollars - of course.
Now Tampa Bay Partnership is funding another unnecessary 14% Tampa centric Hillsborough County rail tax hike. They want to force taxpayers in unincorporated to pay billions for Tampa centric costly rail at the same time the $16 Billion tax hike provides ZERO dedicated funding for new road capacity desperately needed in unincorporated - for 30 years. How more divisive can that be?
Tampa Bay Partnership's kum ba ya moment had an expiration date.
Tyler Hudson, Chair of AFT PAC, is a Board member of the Tampa Heights Civic Association whose members want to tear interstates down.
More schizophrenia…Tampa Bay Partnership aligned themselves with the Tampa urbanists transit advocates who want to tear down I-275 from downtown to Bearss Avenue and replace it with a street level boulevard and a train. Yet at the same time the Tampa Bay Partnership has been pushing the proposed regional BRT on I-275 from Wesley Chapel to downtown St. Pete.
Earth to Tampa Bay Partnership - that includes I-275 from downtown to Bearss Ave. Cannot make this stuff up.  
Tampa Bay Partnership cronies must have lots of money to burn. They threw gobs of money behind both overwhelmingly defeated transit tax hike boondoggles in Tampa Bay in 2010 and 2014 and are doing it again. And 2018 is not 2010 or 2014 as innovation and technology is disrupting traditional transit as transit ridership has been tanking everywhere, including in Hillsborough County.
Tampa Bay Partnership was not elected or appointed by anyone and they do not represent the overall business community in Tampa Bay. They are a pay to play lobbying group of one-percenters who keep funding expensive campaigns for rail tax hike boondoggles and refuse to even consider any other transportation funding solutions.
Insanity is continuing to do the same thing over and over again expecting a different outcome.
The All for Transit tax hike is worse than the 2010 rail tax. The AFT $16 Billion tax hike with its 5 pages of big government regulations ignores funding new road capacity and absurdly prevents  and prohibits changes for 30 years - in a county that is expected to grow by 700-800K over the next 30 years.
This is not just an All for Transit tax hike, this is a 30 year congestion creation tax hike that will cause gridlock on Hillsborough County's arterial roads.
Does BayCare and TGH simply have money to burn?
Why did they decide to financially support an unnecessary massive transit tax hike that hurts the low and fixed income the most? BayCare and TGH benefit from the one-half percent indigent care and trauma center sales surtax that generates over $140 million a year from county taxpayers. They know those who cannot afford to pay for an emergency room visit. Does BayCare and TGH want the low income and the most financially vulnerable to pay for the costly rail they will rarely if ever use.
And we are left wondering why two healthcare systems support a massive transit tax that will negatively impact first responders as congestion increases in a rapidly growing county.
The common denominator is the Tampa Bay Partnership.
Reject them again.
Vote No on the Rail Tax Hike in November!
Posted by Sharon Calvert at 8:28 PM 
This post is contributed by EYE ON TAMPA BAY. The views expressed in this post are the blog publisher's and do not necessarily reflect those of the publisher of Bay Post Internet.
Cross Posted with permission from: Eye On Tampa Bay
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Sunday, September 9, 2018

The Gillum Robocalls

St. Petersburg, Fl
Opinion by: E. Eugene Webb PhD
Author: In Search of Robin, So You Want to Blog.
Andrew Gillum, Democratic candidate for Florida Governor, was the subject of targeted racist robocalls last week.
The robocalls were tied to a neo-Natzi group. You can get more detail from The Tallahassee Democrat writer Jeff Burlew Racist robocalls tied to neo-Nazi group target Andrew Gillum.
The calls were yet another example about how far off the edge, our society and the political process have gone.
What I did find most interesting was the way the news media both print and electronic picked up the story and immediately propagated it all across the country. To me, it is another example of the media being led around by the nose by fringe groups with extremist views.
It only took a few well-placed robocalls for the creator of this trash to reach a huge market for absolutely no effort or cost.
Trump may not be accurate when he says the media are the enemy of the people, but in this case, it seems to me that harping for several days on this issue certainly doesn’t make the media our friends.
We got it early on this was blatant racism.
Yet when criticized the media complain bitterly.  See Bay Post Internet The Print Media Pity Party
To many reporters and television anchors enjoy the seamy side of things, and racism is one they like to exploit for own gains.
I think it is time for writers to think before they write, editors to start editing, managing editors to manage and publishers make sure what they air, and print meets their own journalistic standards if they have any left.
Maybe not our enemies, but not necessarily our friends.
E-mail Doc at mail to: or send me a Facebook (E. Eugene Webb) Friend request. Like or share on Facebook and follow me on TWITTER  @DOC ON THE BAY.
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Friday, September 7, 2018

Clearwater – Mayor for Sale

The right choice here is a  NO vote on the referendum and a vote for the very best City Council members on the ballot.

St. Petersburg, Fl 
Opinion by: E. Eugene Webb PhD
Author: In Search of Robin, So You Want to Blog.
The City of Clearwater is operated under the Council/Manager form of government. In this structure, the Mayor is not the principal decision maker.
Day to day, operations, hiring and firing, and City Council policy implementation are handled by professional City Manager appointed by the City Council. Bill Horne is the current Clearwater City manager; he makes just over $200,000 Dollars per year.
If you happen to live in Clearwater and the name Bill Horne doesn’t ring a bell, that’s just the point. Horne is a manager not a politician. His job is to make the City run safely and efficiently and stay out of the headlines.
A while back, a group of Clearwater “businessmen” began circulating a plan that would change the City of Clearwater from a Council/Manager form of Government to a strong Mayor form of Government.
You can get more detail from Tracey McManus Tampa Bay Times Staff Writer, A strong mayor for Clearwater? Some think it’s time.
Clearwater would be wise to follow Lakeland’s example and send a resound NO on election day.
If you do some research, you will find that most of these efforts are brought by local “business people” not a group of regular citizens. Business people like the strong mayor because he/she is a politician, and they are much easier to influence than a City Manager, who does not need their campaign contributions.
Clearwater only needs to look South to St. Petersburg and see the current strong mayor mess with a pier that the public did not want and is now behind schedule and over budget, a wastewater system that is struggling, questionable staffing at City Hall and more lies than they can count.
One of the sales tactics the “business people” are using to promote this referendum is the assertion that a strong mayor would be better equipped to “deal” with the Church of Scientology and its continued growth in Clearwater’s downtown than the current system.
Read that - the big players would like to be making more money in downtown Clearwater, and the Church tends to get in the way.
I would offer that a strong mayor would not be particularly effective in dealing with what these “business people” see as a problem, and I suspect the Church of Scientology would be just fine with an elected strong Mayor.
If you’re interested in whom the business community is talking about running for the strong Mayor slot in Clearwater check out this recent article by Tracey McManus Tampa Bay Times Staff Writer, As Clearwater prepares to vote on strong mayor, the question is who would run?
A strong mayor form of government in a City dominated by large, powerful entity with significant land holdings is not in the interest of anyone who lives in Clearwater.
The people promoting this change do not understand how these two forms of government work, and their view that they can put their guy in and all will go like they want shows a complete lack of current political reality.
The citizens of Clearwater are much better served by a City Manager, who has their needs and wants clearly in view and is not fishing for campaign dollars to get re-elected with every decision.
The right choice here is a NO vote on the referendum and a vote for the very best City Council members on the ballot.
E-mail Doc at mail to: or send me a Facebook (E. Eugene Webb) Friend request. Like or share on Facebook and follow me on TWITTER  @DOC ON THE BAY.
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